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General Ship Modeling
Discuss modeling techniques, experiences, and ship modeling in general.
Hosted by Todd Michalak
French WW2 submarine
m1garand
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Washington, United States
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Posted: Tuesday, May 14, 2002 - 07:49 AM UTC
Not sure if these will help or not:
http://communities.msn.com/Surcouf/morefromfrank.msnw?Page=1

http://communities.msn.com/Surcouf/frankquerzolipicture.msnw?Page=1


m60a3
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Georgia, United States
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Posted: Tuesday, May 14, 2002 - 08:55 AM UTC
I don't have any refs available, but I know my dad made that same sub, oh, 20 years ago...according to his references, the hull and conning tower were a bronze-green color, the decks a light tan. I'll ask him where he got the information. I know he is very accurate with his references, though. Stay tuned...
Kencelot
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Florida, United States
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Posted: Tuesday, May 14, 2002 - 09:11 AM UTC
Here we are:



Borrowed from here:
http://submarine.id.ru/model3.php?20

Here's a site where numerous email address of naval modelers are listed. I'm more than sure that if you ask nicely, someone will get you the information you need.

http://www.pittelli.com/warship/encf/SubRon37.html

Hope this helps.
staff_Jim
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#002
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New Hampshire, United States
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Posted: Tuesday, May 14, 2002 - 10:06 AM UTC
Or...perhaps ironically there is an image in our own naval model gallery???



This is an RC version but well done. There is anther pic and some history of the ship in that gallery.

Jim
m60a3
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Georgia, United States
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Posted: Thursday, May 16, 2002 - 09:45 AM UTC
Thomas,

He said it was about average for a Heller kit...he did not remember it being much of a problem. I laugh, because he bulds 50% plastic kits, the rest he scratchbuilds from basswood and ship plans...
About the colors, he explained that the green was called Mediterranean Green, and it was a pre-war scheme. The wartime scheme was a light gray hull and upper and lower conning tower with dark gray on the after hull and part of the conn. The second pic on this post is accurate.
The ship was originally thought to be sunk in a collision with a US merchant ship in 42, but recent evidence states that it was purposefully sunk by the Allies to prevent the French from turning it over to the Germans. It was part of the French fleet stationed at Martinique, and it was thought the French there were pro-Vichy. Pretty interesting, yet tragic.
Good luck with the sub!
staff_Jim
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#002
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New Hampshire, United States
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Posted: Thursday, May 16, 2002 - 11:39 PM UTC

Quoted Text


The ship was originally thought to be sunk in a collision with a US merchant ship in 42, but recent evidence states that it was purposefully sunk by the Allies to prevent the French from turning it over to the Germans. It was part of the French fleet stationed at Martinique, and it was thought the French there were pro-Vichy. Pretty interesting, yet tragic.



Bob,
Nick Burges, the person who sent me the pics of the RC sub above, gave me this historical account:


Quoted Text

It was laid down in the 1920's and completed about 1935. If I remember it was about 375'-0" long and displaced 4000 tons. After the fall of France in 1940 it arrived at a British port and we were anxious that it did not return to France and fall into the hands of the Germans. A British party boarded it to give the French an ultimatum when they opened fire on our sailors killing I think 2 of them with 1 French sailor killed. They decided to join us reluctantly but had a surly undisciplined crew, and we put on board 2 liaison naval personnel who had a rough time.

No one knew quite what to do with this monster and it was reported to have escorted a couple of Atlantic convoys although useless for this task. It was so unreliable that it spent most of its time in U.S. and Canadian shipyards being repaired. On its final voyage it was heading for the Panama Canal when it apparently collided with an American freighter and sank with all hands including our 2 naval men. A sad and sorry tale.



The reason I posted this was to question this "new" evidence. Would the allies really have sunk the ship with British naval officers onboard? I guess worse things happened in that war.

Jim
m60a3
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Georgia, United States
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Posted: Friday, May 17, 2002 - 03:26 AM UTC
Jim, I'll have to ask him about where that info came from so that I can provide more info. I remember the freighter story when my dad was building the kit. I'll let you know what I find out.

BTW, I can kick myself for not taking a photo of the model of the Surcouf when I was in the French Musee de la Marine last fall.
m60a3
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Posted: Friday, May 17, 2002 - 03:29 AM UTC
Another link...good 1941 drydock photo of the sub at Portsmouth NH here:
http://www.submarine-history.com/NOVAthree.htm
m60a3
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Georgia, United States
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Posted: Friday, May 17, 2002 - 03:31 AM UTC
Here's the "speculation"
http://communities.msn.com/Surcouf/thestory.msnw
m60a3
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Posted: Friday, May 17, 2002 - 03:46 AM UTC
I found this book as the "smoking gun":
Rusbridger, James. Who sank Surcouf?: the truth about the disappearance of the pride of the French navy . London: Century, 1991. xiii, 209 p., [8] p. of plates.
D 780 R87 1991

swampfox
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Posted: Saturday, July 06, 2002 - 11:33 AM UTC
Man, I love the Surcouf. I wish I could find a model of it myself.