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Modeling in General: Weathering
Discuss general weathering topics here.
Extreme weathering
USMC6094
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North Carolina, United States
Joined: August 30, 2013
KitMaker: 51 posts
AeroScale: 11 posts
Posted: Friday, August 30, 2013 - 07:18 AM UTC
Hello all, this is my first post on this site and I'm kind of nervous to be honest.
About me, I'm currently a college student working on my assoiciates degree in Aviation technology, I'm a prior service Marine, Army Reservist, and law enforcement officer.
Now to my question. I recently decided to build a Sherman thats been basically stripped of everything useful and left to nature.
I plan on having the hull buried at an angle where the engine deck is at ground level, with the engine hatches open and a small tree growing out of the empty engine bay.
Heres my question......where do I start with this as far as weathering goes? I see the scene in my mind and the hulk has no paint left on it, years of accumulated dirt, mud, and scuzz, its streaked from rain and just rotting away.
I'd appreciate any help you guys might be able to give.
Thanks
AJLaFleche
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Massachusetts, United States
Joined: May 05, 2002
KitMaker: 8,072 posts
AeroScale: 328 posts
Posted: Friday, August 30, 2013 - 07:43 AM UTC
Can you get to a museum that restores military vehicles or aircraft and look at the paint condition on the unrestored stuff in the back? That would give you an idea. With your connections in the military, can you get to boneyards for armored vehicles? Those who know these things have said that US paint in WWII was pretty strong so peeling might not be that prominent. Perhaps a visit to an auto junkyard, excuse me, recycling center, might help as well.
USMC6094
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North Carolina, United States
Joined: August 30, 2013
KitMaker: 51 posts
AeroScale: 11 posts
Posted: Friday, August 30, 2013 - 07:53 AM UTC
I used to re-work HMMV's and such and the Carc paint peeled pretty badly when they sat for years. My rusty hulk isnt meant to be a fresh hack job, lol, its going to be a tank thats sunk over the years and has been a prop for other junk that has worn the paint off. I have a picture of a Sherman that was recovered from the Normandy beaches about fifty years after the fact and is a memorial thats about the condition I want to model mine.
When I was at Camp Shelby Miss., about five years ago I saw alot of M1 Abrams that were out to pasture, but they didnt seem to be anything but dirty, as in too clean for the weathering and rust job I want to do to this Sherman.

I'll post pictures of the work I've done so far to the model this weekend.
Thudius
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Uusimaa, Finland
Joined: October 22, 2012
KitMaker: 1,194 posts
AeroScale: 19 posts
Posted: Friday, August 30, 2013 - 11:45 AM UTC
Hi,

Google-fu https://www.google.fi/?gws_rd=cr&ei=Hi4hUt-fDJDOswbgy4CABg#q=tank+recovered+from+swamp

And for rusty, derelict paint: http://www.andreaslarka.net/ps531027/ps531027.html

Hope that helps a bit
USMC6094
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North Carolina, United States
Joined: August 30, 2013
KitMaker: 51 posts
AeroScale: 11 posts
Posted: Friday, August 30, 2013 - 12:34 PM UTC
man thats awesome, the T-34 has the type gound work I want in my diorama, but the tanks itself is in too nice a condition, lol.

Thanks a TON for the links
Thudius
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Uusimaa, Finland
Joined: October 22, 2012
KitMaker: 1,194 posts
AeroScale: 19 posts
Posted: Friday, August 30, 2013 - 11:59 PM UTC
No problem. If you change swamp with river, river bed and so on, you might get some more hits. There were a couple of Stugs pulled out in Poland that are well documented.
USMC6094
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North Carolina, United States
Joined: August 30, 2013
KitMaker: 51 posts
AeroScale: 11 posts
Posted: Monday, September 02, 2013 - 04:23 AM UTC
Thanks again, yesterday I bought some stuff for the diorama and another compact of the Tamiya weathering pigments. So hopefully I'll get to the point of putting the first coat of paint on soon.
retiredyank
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Arkansas, United States
Joined: June 29, 2009
KitMaker: 11,610 posts
AeroScale: 79 posts
Posted: Monday, September 02, 2013 - 08:52 AM UTC
Kind of late, but have your considered using Micro-Marks Rust n Dust?
USMC6094
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North Carolina, United States
Joined: August 30, 2013
KitMaker: 51 posts
AeroScale: 11 posts
Posted: Monday, September 02, 2013 - 12:59 PM UTC
never even heard of it till now, but I havent put paint to the model yet so I'll give it a look and let you know
Thanks for the lead
lawman56
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North Carolina, United States
Joined: July 28, 2010
KitMaker: 9 posts
AeroScale: 1 posts
Posted: Friday, September 06, 2013 - 07:00 AM UTC
Hi Keith,

As prior service myself, and with you being a former Marine, I know you've seen rusted ships and the like. One of the tricks I use in diorama building is to think of something I can find easily, made of a similar material. In your case, think of the effect salt water would have on a ship sunk in a similar manner. If it's fully submerged, not much would change except an accumulation of sea life. Partially submerged would include a rust line, pitting, partially faded and/or dicolored paint, etc...

I might suggest going to www.pacificwrecks.com as they have some photos of various types of equipment still rotting away from the war.

Another invaluable resource to me is the old fashioned "Google search" for images. Amazing what you'll find.

Hope that helps some.
USMC6094
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North Carolina, United States
Joined: August 30, 2013
KitMaker: 51 posts
AeroScale: 11 posts
Posted: Sunday, September 08, 2013 - 05:15 AM UTC
Joe,
thanks for the heads up about pacificwrecks, I had forgotten ALL about them. And would you believe I saw more rusty junk when I was active in the Army than I ever did in the Corps, lol

I've got a few pictures of shermans that have sat for years and they seem to only have superficial rust on the outside if theyre in a temperate climate, submerged or partially submerged they accumualte everything, rust, barnicles, you name it. I remember about four or so years ago down at MCB Lejuene they found what they thought was a Sherman turret sticking out of the ground on a firing range and it turned out to be a complete tank that had sunken to turret level over time and been forgotten. Thats the look I'm hope'n to acheive
struman1
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United States
Joined: August 12, 2013
KitMaker: 10 posts
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Posted: Monday, September 09, 2013 - 02:05 AM UTC
Get the weathering mag Rust Issue or go to MIG Jimnez blog or website. The Weather mag also has an extreme weathering book. Best books and info I have ever seen for modelling. At least based on what I have learned the last few months. I came back to the hobby after 10 years and I now look at modelling as an art form instead of trying to exactly recreate the real thing from a factory.
lawman56
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North Carolina, United States
Joined: July 28, 2010
KitMaker: 9 posts
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Posted: Monday, September 09, 2013 - 07:52 AM UTC
Keith,

It's not rust, it's "natural earth tone camo", lol.

To me, it seems the hardest thing to do, in order to achieve the look you want, is to re-create that faded olive green chalk look. Every semi sunk sherman I've ever seen, has paint faded to a purpleish light green with an almost chalky texture. As for the deep rust color, I'm thinking a mix of burnt umber and maybe US Army Helo drab.

There is a model website called "Panzerwrecks" that specializes in modeling abandoned/burnt up armor that's been sitting in the elements, however, their site is down for reconstruction.

Another suggestion is using a variation of the baking soda or the salt & hairspray technique. I'll be interested to see what you come up with and how it turns out.
USMC6094
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North Carolina, United States
Joined: August 30, 2013
KitMaker: 51 posts
AeroScale: 11 posts
Posted: Tuesday, September 17, 2013 - 08:33 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Keith,

It's not rust, it's "natural earth tone camo", lol.

To me, it seems the hardest thing to do, in order to achieve the look you want, is to re-create that faded olive green chalk look. Every semi sunk sherman I've ever seen, has paint faded to a purpleish light green with an almost chalky texture. As for the deep rust color, I'm thinking a mix of burnt umber and maybe US Army Helo drab.

There is a model website called "Panzerwrecks" that specializes in modeling abandoned/burnt up armor that's been sitting in the elements, however, their site is down for reconstruction.

Another suggestion is using a variation of the baking soda or the salt & hairspray technique. I'll be interested to see what you come up with and how it turns out.



Heres about where I want to start Joe, these are two pictures of the M4A3 that was found in the woods at Quantico VA in the past couple years, only mine will be buried at angle covering the running gear with just the tops of the drive sprockets showing above ground.




I'm hope'n to try the hair spray thing, but I'm alittle leary of it even though I've seen great results from it.

I have pictures of the work I've done so far posted on armorama in the constructive criticism sub-forum if you guys want to see where I'm at at the moment