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Armor/AFV: Canadian Armor
Discuss all types of Canadian Armor of all eras.
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M113 Counter Mortar Radar
Trackjam
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Ontario, Canada
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Posted: Friday, October 04, 2002 - 10:12 AM UTC
Hi Guts, Anybody got any pics of the 501B CM radar on the M113? these were in the Combat Training Centre and the arty School in Shilo in the 70's and 80's. As far as I know there were only about a half dozen or so, so pictures are going to be scarce.
210cav
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Virginia, United States
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Posted: Friday, October 04, 2002 - 01:53 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Hi Guts, Anybody got any pics of the 501B CM radar on the M113? these were in the Combat Training Centre and the arty School in Shilo in the 70's and 80's. As far as I know there were only about a half dozen or so, so pictures are going to be scarce.



Paul--is this a unique Canadian radar system? We certainly did not have them on US M113s. I can look in the Jane Books we have at work and if I find it, I'll scan and send to you.
DJ
Trackjam
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Ontario, Canada
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Posted: Saturday, October 05, 2002 - 02:29 AM UTC
As far as I know this was a unique Canadian vehicle. I saw one once in 1983 in Gagetown. I believe the radars were removed and they were all converted back to other uses shortly after that.
210cav
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Virginia, United States
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Posted: Saturday, October 05, 2002 - 06:39 AM UTC

Quoted Text

As far as I know this was a unique Canadian vehicle. I saw one once in 1983 in Gagetown. I believe the radars were removed and they were all converted back to other uses shortly after that.



Paul--as I said earlier, we have a fairly extensive library of Jane's Books and if I find that hummer I will scan and post.
DJ
Ribble
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New Brunswick, Canada
Joined: December 01, 2001
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Posted: Sunday, October 06, 2002 - 02:07 PM UTC
Are you talking about the M113 with the huge square radar mounted on top (looks a little top heavy)? If so, I've got a single (rather crappy) picture around here somewhere I can scan to you. The pic is also floating around the net somewhere, I just can't remember where I saw it last. The pic was taken in 1984 at an open house in Gagetown. I was actually going to scratchbuild it, but gave up for lack of other references. I'll look for it again when I get a few minute. I'd also appreciate some other pics of it

JC Hayes
Sabot
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Posted: Sunday, October 06, 2002 - 10:40 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Paul--is this a unique Canadian radar system? We certainly did not have them on US M113s. I can look in the Jane Books we have at work and if I find it, I'll scan and send to you.
DJ

I know nothing about radars, but I do recall when I was a lieutenant in Germany, our scout platoon usually traveled with a GSR (Ground Surveillance Radar) platoon (or section). They used M113A2s and I thought they had funky radar equipment on the track.
GreyHunter
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Noord-Holland, Netherlands
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Posted: Sunday, October 06, 2002 - 10:54 PM UTC
I found a few pictures of M113s with radar equipment, is the one you look for amongst them?

M113 fitted with AN/MPQ4 mortar locating radar


Green Archer


210cav
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Virginia, United States
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Posted: Sunday, October 06, 2002 - 11:59 PM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text

Paul--is this a unique Canadian radar system? We certainly did not have them on US M113s. I can look in the Jane Books we have at work and if I find it, I'll scan and send to you.
DJ

I know nothing about radars, but I do recall when I was a lieutenant in Germany, our scout platoon usually traveled with a GSR (Ground Surveillance Radar) platoon (or section). They used M113A2s and I thought they had funky radar equipment on the track.



Rob--He is speaking of a counter mortar fire set. The systems you are thinking of are AN/PPS 5 and 5A sets. They tracked personnel and vehicles. We use to have six sets in Combat Support Company (my second command). The abbreviation stands for: Army Navy/Pulse Per Second. They were audio only in the case of the 5 and audio and visual in the case of the 5A. They were almost solely dependant on the skill of the operator, but could be quite effective in the defense.
DJ
Ribble
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New Brunswick, Canada
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Posted: Monday, October 07, 2002 - 02:47 PM UTC
Paul,
This is the Photo I described above that I took on or about June of 1984.

www.geocities.com/m113_adats/M113_Radar.jpg

(cut and paste it, I can't wrap my head around this html stuff)
It looks like the M113 fitted with AN/MPQ4 mortar locating radar from Marcel's post above. Is this what your looking for?
Does Anyone else have photos (hopefully detail photos) of this beast? I may still wanna try my hand at Scratchbuilding it.
JC Hayes


Trackjam
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Ontario, Canada
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Posted: Tuesday, October 08, 2002 - 09:41 AM UTC
That is indeed the beast. I believe there is an actual radar at the artillery museum in Shilo, which is a bit far to go. I'm going to hit up Mr M113 at NDHQ to see if they have any trial data or drawings in the archives. Anyone else out there got anything on this one?
Arty1CD
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Oklahoma, United States
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Posted: Tuesday, October 15, 2002 - 03:49 AM UTC
The United States used a trailer mounted version of the AN/MPQ-4 up until about 1985. The Q-4 radar was used during Veitnam.It was mounted on a two wheeled 1 1/2 ton trailer towed by a duece and a half truck. It was based on old tube techknowlogy and was kindly refered to as "Old Sparky" do to its unkanny ability to deliver quit a shock.. It was replaced by the AN/TPQ-36 radar in current use. MOS for the Q-4 radar was 17B. The MOS for the Q-36 radar is 13R.
210cav
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Virginia, United States
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Posted: Tuesday, October 15, 2002 - 05:22 AM UTC
The counter mortar radar certainly was interesting to observe in Vietnam. I doubt it was as accurate as we would have hoped. I remeber we had a warrant officer running the operation.
DJ